Very interesting open letter to Leica from Luminous-Landscape. A "must read".
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21 Comments
Oh well, another idea for Leica to read. It seems fairly obvious that Leica is aware of the M line at this point as read in LFI issue -1/2009/December January.
It’s starting to be old news now how past decisions hand-tied the company, and how the new owners/management at Leica are getting back to speed. I agree that the M line (body) is a bit ‘old hat’ and that it needs a modern update without losing it’s tradition, though the manual focusing rangefinder is enjoyable to use and has it’s limitations like most other forms of focusing.
Perhaps as mentioned in LFI that a body will come that allows for the use of existing R and M lenses. There is more coming from Leica – in time we’ll all get used to the idea that they are back and are moving forward. I have Faith in that.
I think it would be a grave mistake to change the m series to an electronic viewfinder. I have a Konica Minolta with a megapixel evf that was quite special five years ago and from what I’ve read is still nearly unsurpassed. Although comparitively good it was still sh!t compared with a pentaprism or rangefinder. The non-m series has never been a favorite or a classic. The new “point and shoot” Leicas are certainly nothing special and I wouldn’t pay more than a couple hundred dollars for one. The S2 is aimed at the studio crowd and is not a classic either, although I’m certain it is one of the better mfs out there. Leica has a really strong niche with its m series that should serve them well long into the future if they don’t blow it. I could never afford a Leica, at least not a “real” one, but those that can afford it buy them because they are classics and do things that other cameras cannot. I think the author of the article really doesn’t see how well a rangefinder works, better than autofocus, for the sort of pictures that camera is designed to take.
I think the M line is simply too deeply rooted in history and special to ever “change”. Maybe Leica can come up with a new line of cameras that can be aimed to be more “modern”. I’d be a very sad man if the M line ever changes. :/
I agree with his ergonomics section completely. Dont really like the idea of replacing the rangefinder. I can take faster, more focused shots with my M9 than with my E-p1. Maybe a combination of the 2. In the next few years the inside components will only get smaller, allowing room for a CMOS sensor and larger screen. That would eliminate the need for a EVF and be a more natural evolution to the model.
My main complaint would be to use a better screen and fix the auto white balance for darker scenes.
I think they should expand the X line with the suggestions from LL and keep the M line the way it is.
This may be controversial but at the end of the day, does Leica think it makes a better shutter, a better light meter or uses a better sensor that those used in Nikon, Canon etc? I don’t think so. So what differentiates a Leica from other cameras these days? Quite simply, its the lenses. I shoot Leica, Canon and Nikon and each serve a different purpose. Leica is M7 and mostly with my 50mm summilux and to be honest, I use this much more than my Nikon or Canon (digital). Why? My summilux is superior. Ok, why not buy the M9 then? Put simply, I just don’t see the value. I am fortunate enough that money is not the issue, the issue is common sense.
I just ordered an Olympus E-P2 with M-mount adaptor and I am going to use my 50 mm Leica and 28 mm Leica on it giving me a 56mm and 100mm in ‘real’ terms. If I need 28mm I will use it on my M7. I feel this is the best of both worlds as I get to use the best lenses in the world combined with the latest in sensor technology and at £860 for the E-P2 body, when the E-P3 comes out with a better sensor in 6 months time, I will sell the E-P2 and upgrade at minimal cost.
I call this combination “The thinking man’s Leica”. Guys, Leica in 2010 is about the lens, its not about the shutter, meter or the metal around the ‘non-leica’ sensor. Lets accept this and move on.
Physically, I prefer my M6 over the M9 as a camera. The M6 is smaller, and small is good. I travel a lot and the less I carry (volume and weight) the better (you try rock climbing or cross country skiing with a Nikon D700 and two lenses). That said, having to deal with scanning of my film and digitizing the images once I get home is a big enough of a pain that my M6 stays in my closet (unless I am traveling somewhere super cold where batteries die quickly and sensors start to lose pixels, or where I have to shoot super constrasty images where film STILL provide better expsoure and color latitudes). To evolve the M9 into something even bigger/heavier, or with more accessories, defeats at least my purpose of owning one. Are the M9 lenses better than the other 35mm lenses out there? Yes for the most part and that is a big reason to own one. But if the M9 body (or M10, M11, whatever) starts to get larger, then I might as well start using my Mamiya 7II, Hasselblad, or some other medium format camera that may not have as sharp of lens but the film/sensor size of the medium format more than compensates for any differences between the quality of the lens when the images are enlarged to the same size. Though not entirely convinced of its supposedly superior sensor technology, I am open minded to the Olumpus E-P2 and respect the “thinking man’s Leica,” but call me a brand whore, I like the look and feel of a genuine Leica
Sadly, Michael Reichmann could not photograph his way out of a wet paper bag.
@ David
Yes, agreed about the feel of a genuine Leica. That is why I own and love my M7 and always will. Just not sure what Leica are putting out these days is a ‘genuine Leica’. What about a digital back for an M7? One that we can swap out every year or so.
Thing is, that is not a whole lot different from an E-P2 with a full frame and Leica glass.
What about Olympus putting out a full frame E-P’9′ for £1,900 with built in stabilisation. Just saying…
Fact is
I am not familiar with the E-P2, but when you say there is not a lot of difference, are you basing that on image comparisons that you have conducted? For the same reason that third-party lenses do not always work well on the Leica (especially the M9 given the focal length to the sensor, what is your assurance that each of the Leica lenses will work well with the Oympus? Why bother with such trouble when you can just buy the M9? If money is the issue, then that begs the question of why buying Leica at all?
Of course, I am aware the general unvailability of the M9.
All of MR’s comments are basically well taken, especially about the ‘ergos’ of the camera body. There are better, though debatably less charming, form-factors possible now than what they thought of in 1950. I’d like to see an ‘add-on’ EVF with the features he describes; However- EVF finder tech is presently, and for the near future, at a stage were any high-quality example that is put into production will be obsolete within a year or two. At Leica prices, no one is going to want to buy a new, [even genuinely]improved finder for $1500 or $2000 every couple of years. BTW, a really good color finder for a broadcast HD camera, which is only moderately annoying to look at all day) costs $8000.
I like the ideas mentioned in the open letter to Leica. I have never used an M but it is fascinating and sure one day I will end up with an M8 or M9. Today I am satisfied with my Digilux 2, which has enough “horsepower” to me. I think there is STILL a market for digital M with conventional technique of focussing and Leica will continuing that line until there is a really need for another new camera design. But htat day is in the far future.
I have been in the guided tour in Solms about one year ago and I saw that Leica is not a factory, it is really a manufactory! I saw: “Leica is M, M is Leica”.
It is the main product and the centre of Leicas existence I think. It is the soul of that company. At the moment they will not (and they cannot) cutting this M line although they have a new S2, and a new line for amateurs, called X-Line (which will, I hope, continue to a parallel(!) X2 product on the market). By the way: I am really tired of that lines with only ONE camera. You can see that with the D-Lux line: There is still a good reason for offering a D-Lux 3 AND a D-Lux 4! There are some very special differences of both cameras, they are not following models only! Maybe that “one after the other” modelling politics is made by Panasonic, which is the other part in the game of “Panaleica cams” called D-Lux and C-Lux line (and think about the fine V-Lux 1 which has never updated!!)
But – back to the main theme: I think there has to be 2 new products for already established leica users and maybe new ones: 1st will be a solution to use the Leica R lenses since they stopped the R-line (which was hard for the R-customers but necessary for the profit of the company itself). 2nd is a product which could use the marvellous M-lenses with manual autofocus an electronic viewfinder (something like the Olympus Pen-2). So M could still exist and continuing because of the outstandig product (no competitor to be seen, never will be one). And it could be added with another special product which use the outstanding Leica-lenses of the M-Line!
So the future is exciting – I hope Leica will see the markets needs beside the M line which has still a right to exist (sure!). I am optimistic: Leica has now so much experience made during developing the S2 that I would wonder if that manufactory would not put efforts to invest these experiences in new outstanding products soon!
@David – what browser are you using?
Please don’t distract Leica. They haven’t yet fulfilled their promise to come up with something upon which to hang our R lens paperweights.
@LR Admin:
On my PC I have IE 7.0 (from my work computer) which is being upgraded to IR 8.0. I have Safari on my iMAC and there is no issue there.
@David:this is weird, I do not have any problems, let me look into this
@ Admin
Sorry correction, my IE is 6.0 (very very old). My work computer is finally getting updated to IE 8.0; maybe the problem will go away then.
IE 6 is one of the worst browsers. Ever.
I believe with an adaptor, the R lenses can be used on the E-P1 (and E-P2).
@David
Try Firefox. It is much better.
Google’s Chrome is not at all bad although it is at an early stage of development.